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Q&A #95: The Limits Of The Short Stack Advantage

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Short StackOver the past few weeks I’ve been talking a lot about short stacks and how you can gain an inherent advantage simply by buying in for less than your opponents. Something I said, however, struck Joe, today’s questioner, as wrong, and he submitted the following:

First off, I must say that I highly respect your writing. I love all the books I’ve read that you’ve co-authored, and I think you’re a really great guy.

However, I have a problem with something you said in your article in Card Player. I was trying to correct another player who was citing you, only to find out you did indeed say what he was implying.

I don’t subscribe to the magazine, but you were quoted as saying:

The peddlers of the biggest myth will tell you that having a shorter stack then everyone else puts you at a disadvantage. Not only are they wrong, but the opposite is true. No matter what stack size you play, you enjoy the advantage when you are playing opponents with much deeper stacks.

I’m fairly certain these statements are false without certain qualifications. I understand your arguments that against standard opponents you can have an edge. Against deep stacks that are playing against each other with implied odds in mind, you have an immediate (preflop) opportunity to punish their weaker hands. True.

However, against a better opponent, who takes into account the fact that a short stack is still to act or is already in the pot, and adjusts accordingly, you do not have an inherent advantage. Namely, they could tighten up to the point that their play is not exploitable by a short stack. More likely, they would tighten up to somewhere in the middle where they are making the most profit taking into account the deep stacks and your short stack. You would have a (tiny) advantage in the latter case, but not in the former. The important thing to keep in mind though is that it does not guarantee you an advantage. To state otherwise would go against the same argument you made against deep stacks having an advantage, citing the table stakes rule.

Because of this, to state that under all conceivable conditions, having the shortest stack at the table puts you at an advantage is wrong. Under most conditions, yes I agree that you are forcing a (small) advantage for yourself. But I think such a statement probably leads a lot of players into thinking playing a short stack is “best”, when in reality no stack size is theoretically best. “If ed says playing with a short stack always puts you at an advantage, then it must be best. I’m going to always play with short stacks.” In my opinion (obviously not yours) this will stunt their growth in the long term. We could argue all day about what stack size is the best to learn with, but that’s an entirely different issue.

You said “I’m fairly certain these statements are false without certain qualifications.” Instead, I would say that they are true in the vast majority of real-life situations. In other words, I agree with you.

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3 Responses to “Q&A #95: The Limits Of The Short Stack Advantage”

Toonces
@ Tue Dec 04, 2007 06:31:06 PM
1

The other caveat that his gone away some in the discussions that included tournament talk is that in a raked cash game, the smaller your stack, the more that the rake affects your return rate. Thus having a really small stack gives you an advantage over the other players, but the rake takes a bigger bite of your advantage.

Ed Miller
@ Wed Dec 05, 2007 03:23:31 PM
2

In a $1-$2 blind game with a $4 rake, I think the rake would eat up all your advantage… and potentially more than that.

I want to make clear that this series isn’t my plea for everyone to run around buying in for 20BB. That’s absolutely not my point.

My main point is that I think a lot of people persist in fundamentally misunderstanding how short and deep stacks interact with one another in NL games… cash games and tournaments. The idea that big stacks can “bully” small stacks (and that the bullying is an effect of the fundamental math of the game rather than the psychology) is still pervasive, and I’m mostly just trying to debunk it.

My second point is that NL can be scary for a lot of players. Lots of people play a very weak-tight brand of NL, and I think at the root of it for many players is a fundamental fear of getting stacked. People buy in for $200 or whatever, but then they do everything they can to avoid any confrontation (without the nuts, of course) for more than about $50. That’s a TERRIBLE way to play NL, and if you’re going to play that way, I think you’re a whole lot better off buying in for $50 and learning that getting stacked is part of the game and no big embarassment/letdown.

A tertiary, minor point is that if you’re a good, but not awesome player, and you have a bankroll that supports buying in for about $1,000 at a time, you occasionally will be better off buying in for 20BB at a $25-$50 game than for 100BB at a $5-$10 game. It depends on the players and how the games are playing, but it’s an option you should keep in the back of your mind.

WB
@ Wed Dec 05, 2007 05:42:08 PM
3

Hello guys, i’m profitable short stacking over 50k hands i’m looking for a study partner/s who is deadly serious about getting better fast. email me at windowblocker111@hotmail.co.uk

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