Building a No-Limit Hold’em Starting Hand Chart – Playing in Early Position

Very nice Ed, but I wonder what adjustements I should do in a 6-8 game, it would be nice if you could make some general notes about this later on when you compile/wrap-up everyting.

yes fullring is hardly played online and most player play 6max or are trying to learn 6max

Wouter mentioned full ring is hardly played online (my online these days is restricted to an occasional 45 player $27 or $55 NL SNG on Stars and games I’m trying to learn for home games (such as triple draw).

The situation is different live. In LA you have nothing but full ring except at the higher limits e.g., the 10/20 min buy game at Commerce, Bike & HG. Even there the live players still prefer to play full. Of course in LA the full drop taken on any flop means you can’t play in a tight or short game. Fortunately you will find most tables with multi-way action.

Short of it is I hope you continue to write about full ring.

Ed, as an aside love the new book. I’ve read it about four times and has helped me tremendously with SPR and . Also bought two copies for friends (and to keep them away from the compitition).

~ Rick

To Gaston Jeremy re. six max requirements:

In part one of this series Ed stated that if you are playing six max, just assume the first four positions have folded and use the requirements for middle and late positions (yet to be written). I’m a six max player myself so I’m looking forward to seeing what he recommends for 100 big blind stacks, particularly with regard to blind stealing hands.

In regard to “if you are playing six max, just assume the first four positions have folded and use the requirements for middle and late positions”

I think this is faulty (at least when applied to B&M games). Short handed players have a different mentality (i.e., they are used to and like playing short) than full ring players that may be temporarily playing short (this is more common in B&M of course where it isn’t always so easy to get up and find another table).

Many full ring B&M players will keep the game going in order to see if the three or four empty seats fill with bad players. They won’t do it forever and they tend to play sort of soft while waiting (once again the collection in LA makes playing short in LA almost impossible with a big blind $10 or less).

This means that an UTG player in 6 max will probably be a lot more aggressive than a full ring player in a game where four have folded (or there are three or four empty seats and he is UTG).

Gotta go to Commerce

~ Rick

Rick,

I don’t play live, but I’m sure what you’ve described is true. However, I don’t think GJ was interested in how other people approach the game. I think he just wants to hear Ed’s advice on what constitutes a solid set of openers for a six max game.

I was pointing out that Ed referred to this in the first article in this series in case he missed it.

Yes Tony, I seem to have missed that even tho I did read the first article, thx for the info.

EM,

Great post again.

Just one more favorite hand in early position: A5s. If you’re including ATs surely, we can include A5s for the same reason?
(you’re good post-flop only if you flop flush draw, straight draw or 2-pair)

Ash, the answer to your question is in the first article?

Quote from EM: “Some hands are so good that you can win with them despite the problems. But most aren’t. THAT INCLUDES SOME GOOD LOOKING HANDS LIKE A8s or ATo or T9s. Out of position these hands will bring you headaches, not profits. Avoid them.”

Remember it’s supposed to be a basic chart as part of the ‘easy hold’em’ series, and so designed to keep newbs out of trouble. Playing drawing hands out of position doesn’t really come under that remit.

This might sound wierd but there is some “mental block” (literally) when it comes to folding (rather than limping) PC’s like ATo, 54s, or suited aces OOP (even UTG), they look so good (especially if you have played them a lot in the past)that the signal from my so called brain to the hand to fold the hand does not “get through”, I just play them even tho I shouldn’t - weak mind eh?

Great post Ed.

It seems like the theme is the worse the players are the bigger you can raise up-front with big hands.

In live play the players are much worse. So larger raises up front would be a pretty good bet. But online in general the players are much better and trickier, so the limp/min-raise to re-raise line would probably work best.

ED QUICK QUESTION:

I am still trying to determine what is more profitable, playing online or playing at the casino?

At the casino the players are much much worse! But you see so many fewer hands.

Online you see many many more hands, but in general the players are much better (except for the occasional donk).

At my local 1-2NL game (max buy-in of $300, aka 150BB) they charge $10/hr to play with no rake.

I play full-tilt about 5 tables at once of .50/1.00 NL with rake but no hourly charge.

What does your gut think of which game would be more profitable?

In addition the casino trip is 1 hour there and 1 hour back (gas money, wear and tare on car).

Also, how long should your poker sessions be? I’ve seen even the best players start to waver after too long of a session online or at the casino.

I’ve been a consistent winner online and at live play. With live play the big wins come further apart but the big wins are huge! Taking down monster pots of like $600 with nice sets.

With online the wins are smaller, but more consistent.

A good nite online I’ll make like $100-$200 playing .50/1.00 NL (these wins are closer together)

A good nite at the casino I’ll make like $400-$900 playing 1/2 NL (these wins are further apart)

(p.s. I’m not bankrolled yet to take on 1-2 NL online with 5 tables at once)

The statement “fullring is hardly played online” simply isn’t true. Right now at the two biggest US-friendly online poker rooms, at $100 and $200 NLHE, there are 1196 FR players and 1104 SH ones. The relative proportions vary from room to room however.

Online games are mostly 9-handed rather than 10-handed however. In fact one of the smaller networks moved from 10- to 9-handed in a recent update.

Ed, I was surprised when you said “Generally, you can reraise with your strong hands (AA-QQ and AK at least).” I have the idea that just calling a reraise with QQ and AK was normal (perhaps I picked that idea up from Harrington?). Generally, I want AA or KK to put in a third raise against a typical player. Do you really think QQ and AK are ahead of the reraising range in a game like this? They may have JJ or AQ some of the time, but is it often enough? I play more online than live, and I’m assuming a mix of LPs and LAGs, but there are more passive than aggressive players in the online games I’m used to ($50 NL at one of the donkier sites).

SelfMade - where do you play online? which are USA friendly… i’ve been full tilt and newbodog

Ducks, you can find info about which rooms are US friendly (and traffic data by game, limit, etc.) at PokerSiteScout.com.

Where is that f* CHART?

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